pin't: Difference between revisions
(Created page with "'''pin't''' is a common ''nasin'' that avoids the phrasal-modifier-grouping particle ''pi''. To most users, pin't involves restructuring sentences to compensate for the loss of ''pi'', so it generally does not change Toki Pona grammar. ==Motivations== <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner"><div class="thumbcaption"><center> '''(This is REAL Grammar, done by REAL Tokiponists)''': Is <code>A</code> ''pi'' <code>B</code> <code>C</code> ''pi'' <...") |
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{{tp title|pi}} |
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'''pin't''' is a common ''[[nasin]]'' that avoids the phrasal-modifier-grouping [[particle]] ''[[pi]]''. |
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'''{{tp|pi}}n't''' is a common {{tp|[[nasin]]}} that avoids the phrasal-modifier-grouping [[particle]] {{tp|[[pi]]}}. |
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To most users, |
To most users, {{tp|pi}}n't involves restructuring sentences to compensate for the loss of {{tp|pi}}, so it generally does not change [[Toki Pona]] grammar. |
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==Motivations== |
==Motivations== |
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{{Figure|<center> |
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<div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner"><div class="thumbcaption"><center> |
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'''(This is REAL Grammar, done by REAL Tokiponists)''': |
'''(This is REAL Grammar, done by REAL Tokiponists)''': |
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Is <code>A</code> |
Is <code>A</code> {{tp|pi}} <code>B</code> <code>C</code> {{tp|pi}} <code>D</code> <code>E</code><br /><code>A</code> ({{tp|pi}} <code>B</code> <code>C</code>) ({{tp|pi}} <code>D</code> <code>E</code>)<br />or <code>A</code> [{{tp|pi}} <code>B</code> <code>C</code> ({{tp|pi}} <code>D</code> <code>E</code>)]? |
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'''They have played us for absolute fools''' |
'''They have played us for absolute fools''' |
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</center> |
</center>}} |
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There are many perceived issues with {{tp|pi}}: |
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===Complexity=== |
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There are many perceived issues with ''pi'': |
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{{tp|pi}} adds complexity and makes understanding a more demanding task. Longer phrases with multiple modifiers already make it more difficult for listeners to keep up, compared to [[Multiple sentences|using full sentences]], and only describe loose relationships between the head and the modifier. Adding {{tp|pi}} increases the complexity exponentially. |
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===Misleadingness=== |
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* ''pi'' is misleading and difficult to explain. Learners who encounter ''pi'' are prone to extend it to proscribed uses, like assuming that it means "of", marks possession, has some other [[semantic (value)|semantic value]], or can be used in ungrammatical positions. Correcting them requires vigilance and very specific explanations. |
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{{tp|pi}} is misleading and difficult to explain. Learners who encounter {{tp|pi}} are prone to extend it to proscribed uses, like assuming that it means "of", marks possession, has some other [[semantic (value)|semantic value]], or can be used in ungrammatical positions. Correcting them requires vigilance and very specific explanations. |
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*: Even ''pi''<nowiki />'s etymology (from Tok Pisin ''bilong'', from English ''belong'') is misleading about its current, non-possessive use. |
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{{Indent|Even {{tp|pi}}<nowiki />'s etymology (from Tok Pisin {{tp|bilong}}, from English {{tp|belong}}) is misleading about its current, non-possessive use.}} |
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* ''pi'' encourages translating concepts as [[Lexicalization|set phrases]] without any clarifying grammatical particles, instead of choosing phrases dynamically from [[context]] and [[Circumlocution|describing concepts]] in [[Multiple sentences|as many sentences as needed]]. |
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*: Particles like ''[[li]]'', ''[[e]]'', and ''[[la]]'' are crucial to understanding the role of concepts in a sentence. They are not allowed in ''pi'' phrases because they have higher priority than ''pi'' in marking sentence structure. This can be fixed by splitting the noun phrase into a new sentence and replacing ''pi'' with ''li'': |
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*::; ''*jan <del>pi</del> sona e ma li pona.'' |
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*::: ''*pi sona e ma'' is ungrammatical. This sentence could also be corrected to ''jan sona li pona e ma'', which has a completely different meaning. |
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*::; ''jan <ins>li</ins> sona e ma li pona.'' |
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*::: ''li sona e ma'' is grammatical. |
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* ''pi'' creates unpleasant grammar. Slightly "advanced" uses of ''pi'' rapidly overcomplicate the grammar and create ambiguities. |
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*: Even among ''pi'' users, there is deliberately no consensus on some issues, like whether multiple ''pi'' have a flat or nested structure, to encourage people to use more pleasant methods of phrasing. |
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* ''pi'' feels too engineered for Toki Pona's natural design, and so it is aesthetically unpleasant and demands extra mental overhead. |
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** The way that ''pi'' requires a preceding head and at least two following words is overcomplicated, and harder to adjust to than the other particles. |
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** ''pi'' is highly sensitive to changes outside its phrase, and from several words away. Minor changes to a sentence can make a ''pi'' phrase ungrammatical. |
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** ''pi'' also feels like a "spoken bracket" that is common in engineered languages, demanding speakers to keep track of nested phrases like <code>push</code>ing and <code>pop</code>ping a [[wikipedia:Stack (abstract data type|stack]]. |
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* ''pi'' can be confused for the mathematical constant 𝜋, and some speakers are [[nanpan't]] or [[wikipedia:Tau (mathematical constant)|tauist]]. |
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=== |
===Effects on grammar=== |
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{{tp|pi}} encourages translating concepts as [[Lexicalization|set phrases]] without any clarifying grammatical particles, instead of choosing phrases dynamically from [[context]] and [[Circumlocution|describing concepts]] in [[Multiple sentences|as many sentences as needed]]. |
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For some speakers, pin't is a [[Constrained writing|constrained writing]] challenge or a way to creatively further reduce the language. |
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Particles like {{tp|[[li]]}}, {{tp|[[e]]}}, and {{tp|[[la]]}} are crucial to understanding the role of concepts in a sentence. They are not allowed in {{tp|pi}} phrases because they have higher priority than {{tp|pi}} in marking sentence structure. This can be fixed by splitting the noun phrase into a new sentence and replacing {{tp|pi}} with {{tp|li}}. |
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==Strategies== |
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{{Example|*jan <del>pi</del> sona e ma li pona.|{{tp|*pi sona e ma}} is ungrammatical. This sentence could also be corrected to {{tp|jan sona li pona e ma}}, which has a completely different meaning.}} |
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===''pi'' dropping=== |
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{{Example|jan <ins>li</ins> sona e ma li pona.|{{tp|li sona e ma}} is grammatical.}} |
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In some cases, ''pi'' can just be dropped with no substantive change in meaning. |
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{{tp|pi}} itself creates unpleasant grammar. Slightly "advanced" uses of {{tp|pi}} rapidly overcomplicate the grammar and create ambiguities. |
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:;''lipu <del>pi</del> mute ala'' |
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{{Indent|Even among {{tp|pi}} users, there is deliberately no consensus on some issues, like whether multiple {{tp|pi}} have a flat or nested structure, to encourage people to use more pleasant methods of phrasing.}} |
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::not many books |
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:;''lipu mute ala'' |
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::not many books |
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===Engineered-ness=== |
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Some speakers like to drop ''pi'' in other cases as long as the meaning is still easy enough to guess, such as ''tomo <del>pi</del> jan Epawan''. This is fairly nonstandard. |
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{{tp|pi}} feels too engineered for Toki Pona's natural design, and so it is aesthetically unpleasant and demands extra mental overhead. |
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The way that {{tp|pi}} requires a preceding head and at least two following words is overcomplicated, and harder to adjust to than the other particles. |
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===Prepositions=== |
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Replacing ''pi'' with a [[preposition]] can clarify meaning. Prepositions have [[semantic (value)|semantic value]], while ''pi'', as a [[particle]], does not. |
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{{tp|pi}} is highly sensitive to changes outside its phrase, and from several words away. Minor changes to a sentence can make a {{tp|pi}} phrase ungrammatical. |
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:;''kiwen <del>pi</del> kasi suli'' |
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::hard thing <del>with <em>any</em> relation to</del> large plants |
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:;''kiwen <ins>lon</ins> kasi suli'' |
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::hard thing <ins>at, in, or on</ins> large plants (perhaps bark, a rock in the woods, a bramble's thorn) |
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:;''kiwen <ins>tan</ins> kasi suli'' |
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::hard thing <ins>from</ins> large plants (perhaps peeled bark, timber, tree nuts, branches or roots, a fallen apple) |
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:;''kiwen <ins>tawa</ins> kasi suli'' |
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::hard thing <ins>toward</ins> large plants (perhaps an axe, a barrier that plants cannot penetrate) |
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:;''kiwen <ins>sama</ins> kasi suli'' |
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::hard thing <ins>similar to</ins> large plants (perhaps faux wood, a plastic artificial plant, a large post) |
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{{tp|pi}} also feels like a "spoken bracket" that is common in engineered languages, demanding speakers to keep track of nested phrases like <code>push</code>ing and <code>pop</code>ping a [[wikipedia:Stack (abstract data type|stack]]. |
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===<var>π</var>=== |
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{{tp|pi}} can be confused for the mathematical constant 𝜋, and some speakers are [[nanpan't]] or [[wikipedia:Tau (mathematical constant)|tauist]]. |
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===For fun=== |
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For some speakers, {{tp|pi}}n't is a [[Constrained writing|constrained writing]] challenge or a way to creatively further reduce the language. |
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==Strategies== |
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==={{tp|pi}} dropping=== |
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In some cases, {{tp|pi}} can just be dropped with no substantive change in meaning. |
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{{Example|lipu <del>pi</del> mute ala|not many books}} |
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{{Example|lipu mute ala|not many books}} |
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{{Start section|Nonstandard}} |
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Some speakers like to drop {{tp|pi}} in other cases as long as the meaning is still easy enough to guess, such as {{tp|tomo <del>pi</del> jan Epawan}}. This is fairly nonstandard. |
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{{End section}} |
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{{Start section|Nonstandard}} |
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===Prepositions=== |
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Replacing {{tp|pi}} with a [[preposition]] can clarify meaning. Prepositions have [[semantic (value)|semantic value]], while {{tp|pi}}, as a [[particle]], does not. |
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{{Example|kiwen <del>pi</del> kasi suli|hard thing <del>with <em>any</em> relation to</del> large plants}} |
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{{Example|kiwen <ins>lon</ins> kasi suli|hard thing <ins>at, in, or on</ins> large plants (perhaps bark, a rock in the woods, a bramble's thorn)}} |
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{{Example|kiwen <ins>tan</ins> kasi suli|hard thing <ins>from</ins> large plants (perhaps peeled bark, timber, tree nuts, branches or roots, a fallen apple)}} |
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{{Example|kiwen <ins>tawa</ins> kasi suli|hard thing <ins>toward</ins> large plants (perhaps an axe, a barrier that plants cannot penetrate)}} |
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{{Example|kiwen <ins>sama</ins> kasi suli|hard thing <ins>similar to</ins> large plants (perhaps faux wood, a plastic artificial plant, a large post)}} |
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{{End section}} |
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===Possession=== |
===Possession=== |
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There are several ways to phrase multi-word possessives without pi. |
There are several ways to phrase multi-word possessives without pi. |
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{{Example|ni li musi <del>pi</del> jan Epawan.|This is Abraham's art ~ game. (This provokes the similar, but now ungrammatical, {{tp|1=*<u>musi ni li</u> <span style="opacity:0.5;">∅</span> pi jan Epawan.}})|ni li musi <del>pi</del> jan [esun pi ale wan a ni]}} |
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{{Example|ni li musi <ins>tan</ins> jan Epawan.|This is art ~ a game <ins>by</ins> Abraham. ({{tp|<u>musi ni li</u> tan jan Epawan.}} remains grammatical.)|ni li musi <ins>tan</ins> jan [en pilin ale wile awen nasin]}} |
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:;''ni li musi <del>pi</del> jan Epawan.'' |
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{{Example|jan Epawan <ins>li jo e</ins> musi ni.|Abraham <ins>owns</ins> this art ~ game.|jan [e pona ale wawa alasa nena] <ins>li jo e</ins> musi ni}} |
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::This is Abraham's art ~ game. (This provokes the similar, but now ungrammatical, ''*<u>musi ni li</u> <span style="opacity:0.5;">∅</span> pi jan Epawan.'') |
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{{Example|jan Epawan <ins>la</ins> ni li musi <ins>ona</ins>.|<ins>As for</ins> Abraham, this is <ins>their</ins> art ~ game.|jan [en pimeja ante walo ante nasa] <ins>la</ins> ni li musi <ins>ona</ins>}} |
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:;''ni li musi <ins>tan</ins> jan Epawan.'' |
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{{Example|jan Epawan <ins>la</ins> musi ni li <ins>jo ona</ins>.|<ins>As for</ins> Abraham, this art ~ game <ins>is their property</ins>.|jan [esun pakala ala waso ale noka] <ins>la</ins> musi ni li <ins>jo ona</ins>}} |
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::This is art ~ a game <ins>by</ins> Abraham. (''<u>musi ni li</u> tan jan Epawan.'' remains grammatical.) |
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:;''jan Epawan <ins>li jo e</ins> musi ni.'' |
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::Abraham <ins>owns</ins> this art ~ game. |
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:;''jan Epawan <ins>la</ins> ni li musi <ins>ona</ins>.'' |
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::<ins>As for</ins> Abraham, this is <ins>their</ins> art ~ game. |
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:;''jan Epawan <ins>la</ins> musi ni li <ins>jo ona</ins>.'' |
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::<ins>As for</ins> Abraham, this art ~ game <ins>is their property</ins>. |
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===Predicate or sentence splitting=== |
===Predicate or sentence splitting=== |
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Sometimes |
Sometimes {{tp|pi}} can be replaced with {{tp|[[li]]}}. The subject and new predicate might be split into a {{tp|[[la]]}} phrase or new sentence, for clarity as to what the original predicate applies to. |
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{{Example|jan <del>pi</del> kama sona li wile e nasin sin.|Learning people want new methods.}} |
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{|cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" |
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:;''jan <del>pi</del> kama sona li wile e nasin sin.'' |
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::Learning people want new methods. |
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{| |
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|style="padding-right:1em;"| |
|style="padding-right:1em;"| |
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{{Example|jan li kama sona li wile e nasin sin.|People learn and want new methods.}} |
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{{Example|jan li kama sona la ona li wile e nasin sin.|As people learn they want new methods.}} |
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|style="border-left:1px solid currentColor;padding-left:1em;"|(People in general, or only some people? Granted, this can be clear in [[context]].) |
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:;''jan li kama sona la ona li wile e nasin sin.'' |
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::As people learn they want new methods. |
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|style="border-left:1px solid currentColor;padding-left:1em;"|(People in general, or only some people? Though, this can be clear in [[context]].) |
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|} |
|} |
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{{Example|jan li kama sona. jan ni li wile e nasin sin.|Some people learn. These people want new methods. (The "some" is clarified by the later {{tp|ni}}.)}} |
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::Some people learn. These people want new methods. (The "some" is clarified by the later ''ni''.) |
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The obscure particle {{tp|[[ki]]}} has also been suggested for this purpose, but many speakers dislike the idea of a [[wikipedia:Relative clause|relative clause]] marker in Toki Pona and prefer using cross-sentence {{tp|[[ni]]}} for [[recursion]]. |
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Replacing ''pi'' with ''li'' can present opportunities to clarify the words' roles with particles, or get rid of unneeded information in the head phrase before ''pi'': |
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Replacing {{tp|pi}} with {{tp|li}} can present opportunities to clarify the words' roles with particles, or get rid of unneeded information in the head phrase before {{tp|pi}}: |
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:;''mi jan <del>pi</del> pana sona.'' |
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{{Example|mi jan <del>pi</del> pana sona.|I'm a knowledge-giving person.}} |
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{{Example|mi jan <ins><del>li</del></ins> pana <ins>e</ins> sona.|I'm a person <ins><del>and</del></ins> I give knowledge. (The grammaticality and clarity of {{tp|mi … li …}} is debated.)}} |
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{{Example|<del>mi jan.</del> <ins>mi</ins> pana e sona.|<del>I'm a person.</del> <ins>I</ins> give knowledge.}} |
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::I'm a person <ins><del>and</del></ins> I give knowledge. (The grammaticality and clarity of ''mi … li …'' is debated.) |
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{{Example|mi pana e sona.|I give knowledge. (Since I am speaking, you can tell from context that I'm probably a person.)}} |
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:;''<del>mi jan.</del> <ins>mi</ins> pana e sona.'' |
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::<del>I'm a person.</del> <ins>I</ins> give knowledge. |
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:;''mi pana e sona.'' |
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::I give knowledge. (Since I am speaking, you can tell from context that I'm probably a person.) |
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Or it can clarify what the |
Or it can clarify what the {{tp|pi}} applied to when this is ambiguous, such as a possible preposition… within? before?… the head phrase. |
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===Just rephrasing the whole sentence=== |
===Just rephrasing the whole sentence=== |
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Sometimes a sentence with |
Sometimes a sentence with {{tp|pi}} is a lost cause, and it's easier to think of a completely different way to phrase the sentence from scratch than to try to salvage it. |
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[[Category: |
[[Category:Styles of speech]] |
Latest revision as of 08:36, 17 May 2024
pin't is a common nasin that avoids the phrasal-modifier-grouping particle pi.
To most users, pin't involves restructuring sentences to compensate for the loss of pi, so it generally does not change Toki Pona grammar.
Motivations[edit | edit source]
There are many perceived issues with pi:
Complexity[edit | edit source]
pi adds complexity and makes understanding a more demanding task. Longer phrases with multiple modifiers already make it more difficult for listeners to keep up, compared to using full sentences, and only describe loose relationships between the head and the modifier. Adding pi increases the complexity exponentially.
Misleadingness[edit | edit source]
pi is misleading and difficult to explain. Learners who encounter pi are prone to extend it to proscribed uses, like assuming that it means "of", marks possession, has some other semantic value, or can be used in ungrammatical positions. Correcting them requires vigilance and very specific explanations.
Effects on grammar[edit | edit source]
pi encourages translating concepts as set phrases without any clarifying grammatical particles, instead of choosing phrases dynamically from context and describing concepts in as many sentences as needed.
Particles like li, e, and la are crucial to understanding the role of concepts in a sentence. They are not allowed in pi phrases because they have higher priority than pi in marking sentence structure. This can be fixed by splitting the noun phrase into a new sentence and replacing pi with li.
- jan
pisona e ma li pona*jan
pisona e ma li pona.*pi sona e ma is ungrammatical. This sentence could also be corrected to jan sona li pona e ma, which has a completely different meaning.
jan li sona e ma li ponajan li sona e ma li pona.
li sona e ma is grammatical.
pi itself creates unpleasant grammar. Slightly "advanced" uses of pi rapidly overcomplicate the grammar and create ambiguities.
Engineered-ness[edit | edit source]
pi feels too engineered for Toki Pona's natural design, and so it is aesthetically unpleasant and demands extra mental overhead.
The way that pi requires a preceding head and at least two following words is overcomplicated, and harder to adjust to than the other particles.
pi is highly sensitive to changes outside its phrase, and from several words away. Minor changes to a sentence can make a pi phrase ungrammatical.
pi also feels like a "spoken bracket" that is common in engineered languages, demanding speakers to keep track of nested phrases like push
ing and pop
ping a stack.
π[edit | edit source]
pi can be confused for the mathematical constant 𝜋, and some speakers are nanpan't or tauist.
For fun[edit | edit source]
For some speakers, pin't is a constrained writing challenge or a way to creatively further reduce the language.
Strategies[edit | edit source]
pi dropping[edit | edit source]
In some cases, pi can just be dropped with no substantive change in meaning.
lipupimute alalipu
pimute alanot many books
lipu mute alalipu mute ala
not many books
Some speakers like to drop pi in other cases as long as the meaning is still easy enough to guess, such as tomo pi jan Epawan. This is fairly nonstandard.
Prepositions[edit | edit source]
Replacing pi with a preposition can clarify meaning. Prepositions have semantic value, while pi, as a particle, does not.
kiwenpikasi sulikiwen
pikasi sulihard thing
with any relation tolarge plants
kiwen lon kasi sulikiwen lon kasi suli
hard thing at, in, or on large plants (perhaps bark, a rock in the woods, a bramble's thorn)
kiwen tan kasi sulikiwen tan kasi suli
hard thing from large plants (perhaps peeled bark, timber, tree nuts, branches or roots, a fallen apple)
kiwen tawa kasi sulikiwen tawa kasi suli
hard thing toward large plants (perhaps an axe, a barrier that plants cannot penetrate)
kiwen sama kasi sulikiwen sama kasi suli
hard thing similar to large plants (perhaps faux wood, a plastic artificial plant, a large post)
Possession[edit | edit source]
There are several ways to phrase multi-word possessives without pi.
ni li musipijan [esun pi ale wan a ni]ni li musi
pijan Epawan.This is Abraham's art ~ game. (This provokes the similar, but now ungrammatical, *musi ni li ∅ pi jan Epawan.)
ni li musi tan jan [en pilin ale wile awen nasin]ni li musi tan jan Epawan.
This is art ~ a game by Abraham. (musi ni li tan jan Epawan. remains grammatical.)
jan [e pona ale wawa alasa nena] li jo e musi nijan Epawan li jo e musi ni.
Abraham owns this art ~ game.
jan [en pimeja ante walo ante nasa] la ni li musi onajan Epawan la ni li musi ona.
As for Abraham, this is their art ~ game.
jan [esun pakala ala waso ale noka] la musi ni li jo onajan Epawan la musi ni li jo ona.
As for Abraham, this art ~ game is their property.
Predicate or sentence splitting[edit | edit source]
Sometimes pi can be replaced with li. The subject and new predicate might be split into a la phrase or new sentence, for clarity as to what the original predicate applies to.
janpikama sona li wile e nasin sinjan
pikama sona li wile e nasin sin.Learning people want new methods.
|
(People in general, or only some people? Granted, this can be clear in context.) |
jan li kama sona jan ni li wile e nasin sinjan li kama sona. jan ni li wile e nasin sin.
Some people learn. These people want new methods. (The "some" is clarified by the later ni.)
The obscure particle ki has also been suggested for this purpose, but many speakers dislike the idea of a relative clause marker in Toki Pona and prefer using cross-sentence ni for recursion.
Replacing pi with li can present opportunities to clarify the words' roles with particles, or get rid of unneeded information in the head phrase before pi:
mi janpipana sonami jan
pipana sona.I'm a knowledge-giving person.
mi janlipana e sonami jan
lipana e sona.I'm a person
andI give knowledge. (The grammaticality and clarity of mi … li … is debated.)
mi janmi pana e sona
mi jan.mi pana e sona.
I'm a person.I give knowledge.
mi pana e sonami pana e sona.
I give knowledge. (Since I am speaking, you can tell from context that I'm probably a person.)
Or it can clarify what the pi applied to when this is ambiguous, such as a possible preposition… within? before?… the head phrase.
Just rephrasing the whole sentence[edit | edit source]
Sometimes a sentence with pi is a lost cause, and it's easier to think of a completely different way to phrase the sentence from scratch than to try to salvage it.